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Will Tyndale's avatar

Great synopsis of Tainter. After this point of the lesson is usually a call to Appropriate Tech - a movement from the 1970’s that I embrace. But over the years, I see the collapse of Western Liberal Democracy and its particular economic system as not the end of empires. What comes next is destruction by barbarians and looting of our assets by foreign corporations and ethnic mafias. The New York Jewish Mafia, including Jeffrey Sachs, raped Russia after the fall of the USSR. This is what we should expect, pillaging by the Russian Jewish Mafia as well as Mexican Drug Lords and Chinese Corporations.

Dmity Orlov is a Russian American that has taken this view since his book “Reinventing Collapse”. Here is Dmitry speaking today.

https://youtu.be/HpzaXUww-K0?si=DVIDkIFW5dGF0bMM

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John Bunyan's avatar

I don't necessarily disagree with anything you've written, but I'll try a thought experiment: can a full-scale collapse be avoided by reducing the number of problems society is trying to solve? Tainter's thesis seems to assume civilizations will always attempt to solve more problems, but could that desire be arrested? A sort of "managed collapse" in complexity (but without the negative connotations)? It would involve taking away a large percentage of administrative middle-manager bureaucratic jobs, which of course poses it's own problem of what to do with those people's suddenly idle hours (so yeah, I see where Tainter's coming from). Military service? Turbo charge the Peace Corps? Space exploration? Leave them to their own devices and see what happens? There are no good options, I suppose, but perhaps there are less bad ones.

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